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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 20:11:20
I didn't know whether to put this on the med board or the alternative board, but I thought since it was a med interaction issue... Does anyone know if Parnate interacts with St. John's Wort of Sam-E? Have any of you on MAOIs tried taking either of these?
Posted by KaylaBear on December 27, 2009, at 20:58:13
In reply to Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E?, posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 20:11:20
It looks like these doctors want to sell their book, but it still might be worth looking into. Often using google books search lets you view a couple pages, even sometimes chapters.
http://www.haveahealthymind.com/questions-and-answers.html
Q. I suffer from depression. My antidepressants arent working well. Would SAM-e help improve my depression? Can I take SAM-e with my antidepressant?
A. You will find information about SAM-e and how to use it in combination with other antidepressants in our book, How to Use Herbs, Nutrients, and Yoga in Mental Health Care. Take a copy of the book to your doctors office so that the two of you can discuss whether it would be appropriate for you to do a trial of SAM-e.I have yet to find a psychiatrist willing to advise me on either of those herbs, and I've asked 3. My present doc is ok with my experimentation, but didn't seem that interested and I had to quit taking it anyway. Good luck
Posted by willey on December 27, 2009, at 21:28:15
In reply to Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E?, posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 20:11:20
Oh god yess,these are the things which go from minor no no`s to giving parnate a bad rep due to intoxcation when combined.
St johns wort has both ssri features and maoi features,this would be the first one,and if i could yell through the pc not to combine this i would,DO NOT.
Same is a potent supplemtn that can cross the blood brain barrier,i dont have the tech specs off my head to make it clear why its a no no,but i do know it is,the combination can cause severe psychosis and that can be mild.
What goes are you seeking with your augment,if u state this we might be able to speak of some we know that are safe,but usualy i state only my opinion,but here im stating my opinion as fact,do not combine these two mentioned above with parnate,nothing good will come of it.
> I didn't know whether to put this on the med board or the alternative board, but I thought since it was a med interaction issue... Does anyone know if Parnate interacts with St. John's Wort of Sam-E? Have any of you on MAOIs tried taking either of these?
Posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 22:10:32
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E?, posted by willey on December 27, 2009, at 21:28:15
OK, I can give you the St. John's Wort. I figured that it acts too much like an SSRI and can cause Serotonin syndrome. I'm still wanting to hold out hope for the SAM-e. I don't think it would make me psychotic as Geodon has a pretty firm hold in that dept. Beyond psychosis, is there any major concern with serotonin syndrome or similar effects. I'm just desperate here and the reading I'm doing on it makes is sound so good...
Posted by willey on December 27, 2009, at 23:12:13
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E » willey, posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 22:10:32
Heya,not sure what you mean by "ok ill give ya" im only telling the info because im afraid for u to possably hurt urself.
You never mentioned what u need from augneting,i.e a more robust ad action etc.
There are lots of options for augmenting parnate that are fairly safe,however im not sure what u need from augmanting.
If its more ad effect,i promise u samE is not the way to go,i promise u the addition of samE to parnate will not produce good results.
If you need to increase ad property of parnate,known options are adhd stimulants such as low dose aderall,under a strict docs watch.
You also know of notrip being a common add on,however as stated in the study the best way to achieve a better anti depressant effect from parnate is to you the higher dose ranges.
I hope u take my advice on adding samE but regardless i wish u safe and well.
Posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 23:26:39
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by willey on December 27, 2009, at 23:12:13
Why wouldn't Sam-e have an antidepessant effect of some kind?
Posted by Phillipa on December 27, 2009, at 23:50:57
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E » willey, posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 23:26:39
For mild to moderate depression I think but not with an Maoi. Seriously Willey knows parnate. Phillipa
Posted by Nadezda on December 28, 2009, at 0:00:10
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E » willey, posted by inanimate peanut on December 27, 2009, at 23:26:39
I was told by my pdoc not to take Sam-e and parnate.
It would be a very bad idea to try this combination--because of the possibility of serotonin syndrome.
As Willey said, there are lots of different augmenters for MAOIs.
Nadezda
Posted by Sigismund on December 28, 2009, at 1:01:40
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by Nadezda on December 28, 2009, at 0:00:10
>I was told by my pdoc not to take Sam-e and parnate.
Yeah, well, that's how it was for me too on a low dose of Parnate (10-20) with 200mg SAMe.
Not good. Not really social anxiety but similar. I found a library and pretended to read newspapers for a few hours.
Posted by JayBTV2 on December 28, 2009, at 8:51:56
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by Sigismund on December 28, 2009, at 1:01:40
If you have any history of mania I'd definitely avoid Sam-e - especially w/ Parnate.
SAM-E sent me off into mania twice when I was on various other non-MAOi meds...
Just my .02
Posted by inanimate peanut on December 28, 2009, at 10:31:00
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by willey on December 27, 2009, at 23:12:13
Sorry if my phrasing sounded off- I didn't mean anything by it. I'm sure you're right and I appreciate your input and all the help you've given me on this and other stuff. I'm just so desperate for more of an antidepressant effect and my doc won't work with me on other augmentors (Ritalin, nortriptyline, higher doses of Parnate). I thought this might finally be something I could try on my own without the help of a foreign pharmacy. Oh well, I guess back to the drawing board!
Posted by willey on December 28, 2009, at 12:36:29
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by inanimate peanut on December 28, 2009, at 10:31:00
No problem,i understand its frustrating and seems like people just wanna shoot you down,but i was and am often in the same boat.
I will give you my take on parnate,this is what holds true for me,first yess you will notice most parnate posts show users who have augmented it,this is something i always felt which is parnate will not work well long term unless its potientad.However unlike people say,it is user friendly with a lot of meds.
Unforantly it is not with most over the counter stuff,as well as its very hard to include ur doc in this task as they hate to augment parnate.
Also unfortuantly you will spend time often at the drawing board,why its worth doing so,for me anyway is after trying every class of meds parnate is the only one that gave me the pleasure of knowing what the word remission felt like.
Here some avenues u might want to consider in regards to your augment strategy,
Use the word parnate cocktail in your searches,this usualy gives results back of various message groups with people sharing parnate cocktails and opens the door for options.
second one i can mention is a over the counter supplement,however it is strong enough to where it is presription in some places,and does cross into the brain.
It is picamilion,this is a nutrient that has gaba and nicain combined,and if it works is said to produce both a calming and productive feel.It might be listed as a interaction with maois,but everything is,all i can say is ive read many users who saftly combine this inlcuding myself with no interaction seen.A simple search of picamilon will give u its method of action and because its totaly legal sources to buy.
Last,you might have to venture out of the u.s based meds for legal alternatives,one is a med i mentioned earlier called olmifon,its the parent father drug of modfanil,it can be used with parnate however like most stimulants its important to take days off with it in ur combo.Last surpringly one of the better add ons i found was caffiene tabs,vivarin at 7-11 store,this again is contradicted but i was surprised to find it in combo looses its strong up the wall simtulant effect,and instead blends in with parnate to enhance parnates stimulative effect.Also good for the infamous evening fatique parnate seems to have.
It cant be caffiene from bevarges,its just not the same,caffiene tabs are a usp pure form of caffiene.
You also have l theanine a over the counter supplent who again can cross the brain and should not interact with parnate.
So there are options,i posted because the ones u mentioned whether u like it or not where pure dangerous,i along with personal friends have all gone maniac with the two.
If your doc is willing,adhd meds such as mini doses of ritalin or aderall have also been used,but this is very dangerous and needs to be very carefully.
If anxiety is a issue,almost all the benzos,and mood stablizers will work with parnate so that wont require deepsearching.
Just you the term parnate cocktails,not combos as they usualy lost parnate ineraction combos,and search google through both its wb option as well as its group option which contains archives of posts.Im going to cease posting on this here,not because i dont want to help,but rather i dont want to make the mistake to the group of posting to much info that can be taken the wrong way,i post what i do because its what i have come across,please understand this and as ihave learned always make any parnate changes,from including the doc fully,to what augment u use,etc,to be your final decision,always feel comfotable and safe on the decisions u make and never let a post determine the final factor on what u choose to use.I just believe info should be out there and not limited to the very small data were given by glaxco smith.
Please be safe and feel free to email with questions since i wont be posting anymore in depth parnate stuff,i dont wont to in my aim to help cause harm.
Posted by SLS on December 29, 2009, at 6:01:04
In reply to Re: Parnate interact with St. John's Wort or Sam-E, posted by inanimate peanut on December 28, 2009, at 10:31:00
Someone may have already suggested this, but what about using low-dose lithium (300-600mg) or thyroid hormone?
- Scott
This is the end of the thread.
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