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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by jay2112 on April 11, 2021, at 19:42:05
(I don't mean to put one mental pain as worse than another..honestly.) Warning...SI triggers.
I have been struggling with complicated grief for over 30 years. I think I have told my story here. Best friend to suicide by gun at 17...Fiance and child at 27...Mom and Dad one year apart in 2013-2014. And now, losing the dog my Dad got for me two months to the day.
Scientific American reported in the medical journal Lancet, that traumatic grief seems to be followed by what they simply call "Broken Heart Syndrome.." hormonal stress chemicals go off the charts, often simulating a heart attack. Levels of these chemicals up to 30x more than in a test subject. I have been suicidal, and attempted suicide a number of times. Antidepressants, without antipsychotics, leave me very, very vulnerable.
My most recent episode, losing my dog,has been so deeply trying, we are still working hard to 'trick' my brain, and slowly put a stop to the heartbreak and tears. The literature comes up mostly blank in how to treat this. The DSM-V, mercifully, took away the 30 day waiting period, for after a close death, to medically treat grief.
There seems to be a super-hyper adrenal action, but beta-blockers, no matter the dose, lead to nightmares and more tears.I used to respond good to Serzone, with it's various serotonin blocking, but norepinephrine increase, combined with nortriptyline. Then, I started developing horrible nightmares, and more intense suicidal dreams and thoughts.
I won't say the med combo I am on now, because I don't want to jinx myself. But, I would like to try clozapine with my other meds. My pdoc will likely protest, but he knows how deep I am in it all. So, maybe. I don't respond well to many antipsychotics.
I am 51, and kinda feel like I am running out of time. And no, 'dropping' the meds puts the Hell even closer. I can't take lithium because I have kidney disease. I am trying very, very hard to carry on. I am on government disability, but badly want to get some work to bring in a bit of money. Living in poverty does not help....money does buy you some security. And I am scared....24/7. I don't want to go into the hospital because of the death scent of covid. People with disabilities are being left behind...especially if you are older.
The only ray of hope I have is in potentially adopting a kitty. I need some new life. I have signed up for mental health supportive housing. I refuse to go into a group-home, because I NEED control over my own meds, and independence those places stifle. (I worked in those places for years..they are prisons.)
I don't know what to say anymore..I am sorry. :(
Jay
Posted by rjlockhart37 on April 11, 2021, at 20:20:28
In reply to Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by jay2112 on April 11, 2021, at 19:42:05
grief and remorse are more on the pain spectrum of depression, like there's many people on facebook - i have a good profile picture, i look nice, but they deactivated their accounts after i was in the media stream audience. I couldnt believe but i'm used to people going away. It does bring grief and remorse, but after time i realized 'it is what it is' and got used to it. Grief, remorse, broken heart syndrome, there pain spectrum of depression
antipsychotics kinda blunt it out, also benzo's but there numbinig the pain, rather than taking it away
Posted by rjlockhart37 on April 11, 2021, at 20:27:45
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by rjlockhart37 on April 11, 2021, at 20:20:28
there's someone who saw i was in audience on media stream, they deactivated their account, because i was in the audience. I guess it creeped them out, i don't know why....i have a good profile picture, i mean....i post civil things, they just deactiated their account and made a new one to get me off their friend list. This is facebook...not the real world, but after time i think you realize 'it is what it is'. There's people who never get over someone dying, and carrie fisher...they actress who died of drug over dose, her mother debbie reynolds died from broken heart syndrome. Serious, google it. I think having a mental shielf over your heart somemtimes has to be done, or it could damage psyhical aspects like broken heart syndrome
Posted by sigismund on April 12, 2021, at 16:00:05
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by rjlockhart37 on April 11, 2021, at 20:27:45
Why not get a kitty? We all need someone to love and someone to make friends with. Being broken hearted may not be so rare. There are some things we never get over, but looked at another way this make us what we are, for better or for worse.
Posted by jay2112 on April 13, 2021, at 13:10:05
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by rjlockhart37 on April 11, 2021, at 20:27:45
> there's someone who saw i was in audience on media stream, they deactivated their account, because i was in the audience. I guess it creeped them out, i don't know why....i have a good profile picture, i mean....i post civil things, they just deactiated their account and made a new one to get me off their friend list. This is facebook...not the real world, but after time i think you realize 'it is what it is'. There's people who never get over someone dying, and carrie fisher...they actress who died of drug over dose, her mother debbie reynolds died from broken heart syndrome. Serious, google it. I think having a mental shielf over your heart somemtimes has to be done, or it could damage psyhical aspects like broken heart syndrome
My problem is, I don't have that shield over my heart. My bipolar disorder, and major depression seem to prevent that. When I feel better, I have control over that shield, but when majorly depressed, I don't have control. Plus, I have some major health issues with my kidney's and diabetes. When not so good, I worry about dropping dead. So, a whole lotta issues sends me into overload. But, in reality, when I am better, I know with all these problems, that I am gonna live for sometime (knock on wood), and my grief over my parents and little dog...well, I hope we meet again, and that they would all want me to have a good life. Kinda hard to reconcile all of that...very hard sometimes. But, knock me down and I will get myself back in the race again. I try...I try...
Jay
Posted by jay2112 on April 13, 2021, at 13:18:25
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by sigismund on April 12, 2021, at 16:00:05
> Why not get a kitty? We all need someone to love and someone to make friends with. Being broken hearted may not be so rare. There are some things we never get over, but looked at another way this make us what we are, for better or for worse.
Yes...I have been thinking of getting a kitty. Problem is, all of the shelters around here are mostly empty. During Covid, everyone wants a cat or dog. Plus, it costs a bit to get one, and I am on government disability pension, and after all my costs, it would take me a few months to scrounge and save cash. I am trying to get a p/t job, but I gotta stay on the ball. I am not religious, but I pray my current meds keep me on the ball.
And yes, grief is universal, but considering my mental health problems (and physical ones too...my kidneys are failing) man...it is intensely hard to deal with.
So...I am going to try with the pet, but it is gonna take some time.
Thanks kindly,
Jay
Posted by alexandra_k on April 13, 2021, at 17:38:27
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression?? » sigismund, posted by jay2112 on April 13, 2021, at 13:18:25
I was gonna say 'why not get two kitties'. Uh. Just in case something were to happen to one kitty...
Poverty sucks. It sucks to feel like you live in a prison, too.
I feel a lot like that myself. Over the last couple years, particularly. That I live in a prison. That this whole country is concentration camp island, I call it. It is. To me. For me.
I hear you on the job thing. If you can find a job that feels meaningful it's... I think everybody likes to say 'it's a game changer'. It's the phrase of the times.
Because people insist upon playing their games. Life is fun for some. Those who take all the things and declare themselves to be winners.
They reckon that depression is a kind of grief, yes.
Depression is also a kind of psychomotor retardation. Lack of activity, I mean.
In other words, not having meaningful employment is depression yes.
And grief... It's all about stopping. Being stopped.
Incapacitated. Disabled.
Waiting to die.
Nothing to live for.
It's all related.
Posted by Lamdage22 on April 14, 2021, at 1:15:42
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by alexandra_k on April 13, 2021, at 17:38:27
Have you considered a grief-support group? With or without a therapist? Psychotherapy? If you have already tried, you can always find another provider with the same or a different approach to therapy than the previous one.
Posted by Lamdage22 on April 14, 2021, at 1:26:20
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by Lamdage22 on April 14, 2021, at 1:15:42
I would reach out for empathy and connection.
Posted by Lamdage22 on April 18, 2021, at 3:37:20
In reply to Re: Grief...the most intense form of depression??, posted by Lamdage22 on April 14, 2021, at 1:26:20
I haven't had much experience with grief, but that won't last forever. It reminds you of your own mortality.
This is the end of the thread.
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